We’re revisiting one of our most-loved conversations from this show—an exploration of how transformation takes shape in our lives and how we can bravely meet it, even when it’s terrifying.
In this encore episode, we look back on Jen’s conversation with poet and community-builder Joy Sullivan, whose own “chosen change” became a leap toward more sanity, more love, and more joy.
After years of living according to scripts written by others, Joy found herself standing at a crossroads, feeling the pull of something deeper and more true. What followed was a radical leap into the unknown—a move that reshaped her life, her faith, and her art, including her book ‘Instructions for Traveling West’ – a collection for anyone flinging themselves into their own fresh starts.
Together, she and Jen talk about the “incremental scoots” we make before the big leap, the beauty and ache of reinvention, and how stillness can become a sacred space for clarity. Joy shares her story of walking into the unknown and learning to trust her intuition along the way.
In this episode, we reflect on:
- The difference between a change that happens to us and one we choose
- Embracing loneliness and stillness as paths to self-discovery
- Lessons that taught Joy to love herself more deeply
- Why poetry gives language to what we cannot say aloud
If you’re feeling the pull toward something new but uncertain, this encore offers a gentle reminder that change—though often uncomfortable—is where our truest selves begin to emerge.
In this heartfelt episode, Jen and Amy welcome friends, Justin McRoberts and Scott Erickson, to delve into the tender complexities of depression, creativity, and faith. Together, Scott and Justin have built a body of work around the intersection of art, prayer, and healing, including their newest project: In the Low: A Prayerbook for the Seasons of Depression. Today they share personal stories and insights on how art and spirituality can serve as companions through life’s most isolating lows.
This episode offers a compassionate perspective on navigating mental health challenges and finding hope in unexpected places. If you’ve ever found yourself in a season that was super dark or unbearably heavy, this conversation will bring you comfort.
For a special treat this week, we’re bringing you some highlights straight from Jen’s recent Awake book tour in a limited series we’ve dubbed “Road Trippin’ with Jen”. Every tour stop, audience, and special guest brought its own kind of magic, so we’re excited to share some of the best moments with you here on the podcast.
On this Road Trippin’ stop, Jen shares the stage with two powerhouses. In Houston, board-certified OBGYN and best-selling author, Dr. Mary Claire Haver, shares her journey and insights into women’s health, particularly around menopause and midlife. She unpacks our burning questions—why brain fog shows up before periods change, why sleep matters, and how a “menopause toolkit” can set us up for strength, longevity, and joy. This conversation delves into the complexities of menopause, the importance of nutrition, sleep, and movement, and the power of community and connection. Together we learn how to thrive in mind, body, and spirit during this transformative phase of life.
Then we head to the Music City of Nashville, where comedian and truth-teller Heather Land talks about using humor to survive whatever garbage life throws at us, pivoting careers in midlife, and choosing honesty as a way to create belonging. Heather reminds us that laughter can be holy too, and when every other thing fails, humor has a way of breaking us open just enough to let the light in. Tune in for an evening that was equal parts comedy set, revival, and group therapy.
In this episode, we’re joined by Emmy Award–winning journalist and fierce midlife advocate, Tamsen Fadal, who has become a trusted voice for women navigating the complex — and often misunderstood — journey of menopause. Through her work and her new book, How to Menopause: The Essential Roadmap to Resilience and Empowerment in Midlife and Beyond, Tamsen is on a mission to rewrite the narrative around aging, helping women feel seen, supported, and empowered.
Her book is packed with practical tools, honest storytelling, and a powerful message: this phase of life isn’t something to endure — it’s an opportunity to reinvent, reconnect, and rise. From demanding better healthcare to breaking the silence in the workplace, Tamsen is helping women turn midlife into a movement.
In today’s enlightening conversation, we unpack:
- The biggest myths about menopause we need to bust
- How to become your own best advocate in the doctor’s office
- Why midlife isn’t an ending — it’s a beginning
Whether you’re in the thick of it or just beginning to notice the shifts, this episode will leave you informed, inspired, and ready to take action. Share this episode with a woman you care about!
Today, Jen has a discussion with her longtime friend, brilliant thought-leader and activist, Austin Channing Brown. You probably know Austin from her viral first book, I’m Still Here: Black Dignity in a World Made for Whiteness, which flew off shelves in 2020 following the murder of George Floyd, as we were witnessing worldwide protests, calls for police reform, and a radical change to our racial justice systems. Countless people trusted Austin to help them unpack and understand the racial reckoning going on in our country at that time.
Now, Austin is releasing a new project that shares some of her hard-fought learnings gained since that tumultuous time. Full of Myself: Black Womanhood and the Journey to Self-Possession is a love letter to the black women, like Austin herself, who are exhausted from being everything to everyone but themselves. Across essays titled “I Love Myself When I Am Laughing,” “When I Am Awkward,” “When I Am Failing,” and more, Austin celebrates the fullness of her humanity. Each chapter becomes a mirror, asking women—especially Black women—to consider where they’ve given themselves away and what it would mean to live with self-possession instead.
Highlights from this conversation include:
- What it means to Austin to be “full of herself”—a phrase she reclaimed as an act of resistance, dignity, and spiritual integrity
- What happens in our bodies when we operate out of alignment with ourselves
- What it means to be a Black woman striving to live fully in a world that often demands her silence, her labor, and her conformity
- And the inspirational, life-saving advice that Austin received from activist, Tarana Burke
This is such a good conversation starter and one to be shared, for sure.
What happens when the faith you were raised with no longer fits? Join us as we dive deep into the journey of faith deconstruction, exploring the possibilities of holding onto core beliefs while letting go of harmful narratives.
Our guest, Mary Katherine Backstrom, built a life inside evangelical certainty, but one day it all began to unravel—in her marriage, in her career, and in her faith. Left to process a myriad of feelings no one is prepared for in a moment such at that—a misalignment of her heart and mind in respect to her faith, processing the trauma that purity culture effected on her relationships, the grief and resentment she felt over being robbed of so much joy in her early life, the mounting questions of doubt and feelings of uncertainty, not to mention the cataclysmic rupture happening within her community and the response she was getting from people bearing witness to the changes she was making.
As MK shared, “I feel like I dropped the bomb”, but the encouraging takeaway from her message today and what she talks about in her painfully honest, laugh-out-loud memoir, Not That Wheel Jesus, is, “I walked through the rubble, I danced in the fire pits with my friends, and I’ve emerged into this quiet post-apocalyptic space where I can hear my own voice. I really have no idea what comes next, but at least I have me. There’s some goodness in the quiet.”
Whether you’re in the midst of your own faith evolution or simply curious about the topic, you’ll want to listen to this episode. It’s going to resonate with so many listeners. Don’t forget to leave us a voicemail with your thoughts over at jenhatmaker.com/podcast!
