We’re revisiting one of our most-loved conversations from this show—an exploration of how transformation takes shape in our lives and how we can bravely meet it, even when it’s terrifying.
In this encore episode, we look back on Jen’s conversation with poet and community-builder Joy Sullivan, whose own “chosen change” became a leap toward more sanity, more love, and more joy.
After years of living according to scripts written by others, Joy found herself standing at a crossroads, feeling the pull of something deeper and more true. What followed was a radical leap into the unknown—a move that reshaped her life, her faith, and her art, including her book ‘Instructions for Traveling West’ – a collection for anyone flinging themselves into their own fresh starts.
Together, she and Jen talk about the “incremental scoots” we make before the big leap, the beauty and ache of reinvention, and how stillness can become a sacred space for clarity. Joy shares her story of walking into the unknown and learning to trust her intuition along the way.
In this episode, we reflect on:
- The difference between a change that happens to us and one we choose
- Embracing loneliness and stillness as paths to self-discovery
- Lessons that taught Joy to love herself more deeply
- Why poetry gives language to what we cannot say aloud
If you’re feeling the pull toward something new but uncertain, this encore offers a gentle reminder that change—though often uncomfortable—is where our truest selves begin to emerge.
In this special encore episode, we revisit a doozy of a conversation between Jen and Elise Loehnen, author of On Our Best Behavior: The Seven Deadly Sins and the Price Women Pay to Be Good. In this episode, Elise discusses how deeply ingrained patriarchal narratives create a policing effect on women’s behavior, historically using concepts like the seven deadly sins to restrict women and enforce an idealized “goodness.” She unpacks the insidious ways women are conditioned from a young age to suppress normal human drives like anger, ambition, and sexuality.
This conversation, which absolutely blew our minds, explores how patriarchy not only shapes our systems but also gets inside us, training women for “goodness” while men are trained for power. We talk about everything from motherhood to anger to unlearning patterns that have kept us small, and imagining a freer, truer way of being for ourselves and future generations.
Whether you caught it the first time or you’re hearing it fresh, this is one of the most insightful and hopeful conversations we’ve had on the show.
Sometimes the deepest growth comes from the hardest seasons. An untreatable diagnosis, a painful divorce, the loss of hard-earned savings—when life tears apart the script we imagined for ourselves, we’re left to wrestle with who we are, what we value, and how to begin again.
In this special encore episode, poet and bestselling author Maggie Smith joins Jen for a tender, hopeful conversation about finding light in the aftermath of loss. Jen shares how she first discovered Maggie’s work (spoiler: Shauna Niequist played matchmaker), and together they swap stories of navigating divorce, rediscovering hope, and daring to rebuild.
Maggie opens up about the unexpected end of her marriage, the daily pep talks she wrote just to survive, and how those words became lifelines for thousands of others. Along the way, she reminds us that even when our script gets flipped, we can trust “future us,” make peace with uncertainty, and emerge stronger, more grounded, and ready for what comes next.
If you’ve ever felt adrift in the dark or questioned your worth in the wake of loss, this encore episode will remind you that you are loved, worthy, and capable of carrying on—step by step, word by word.
It’s time for another beloved encore presentation and this time we are bringing back this powerful podcast therapy session for your benefit and enjoyment.
Dr. Sara Kuburic, an existential psychotherapist and author behind The @Millennial.Therapist, offers profound insights into taking ownership of our lives. Dr. Kuburic champions the idea that we are free and responsible agents, shaping our own development through our choices. While it’s easy to blame external forces for unhappiness, she encourages us to embrace the amazing opportunity to engage in life fully. She poses a crucial question: how much of what we face is inflicted by us, and how much just happens? As a therapist, she equips people with tools to navigate life’s challenges, asking: “what can you change or how can you change your attitude so the situation is less painful for you?” Beyond existential thought, Jen and Dr. Kuburic explore self-loss and how we can unknowingly deceive ourselves into believing we’re living the life we desire, even as our bodies signal distress through depression, anxiety, and panic.
Jen and Dr. Kuburic get honest about:
- The difference between loving the “idea” of who you are versus who you actually are, and how to stop self-deception.
- The point when avoiding change becomes more painful than embracing it.
- Acknowledging our physical limits: how our bodies send red flags like anxiety, fear, or panic, even when we feel strong.
- How an all-consuming dedication to making something work, even if it’s not right for us, can lead to our weakest moments if we don’t face the truth.
