The Tears of Things: Living Prophetically in an Age of Outrage with Richard Rohr

Today, Jen and Amy sit down with a treasured friend of the show, Franciscan priest and truth-teller, Father Richard Rohr. Father Rohr has been a genuine hero of the faith who has guided us through much uncertainty over the years. Sometimes, we turn to him for mystic insights into lighter things like our Enneagram types and relationships. But today, we turned to him for help processing the anger, grief, and dismay we feel living in America right now. And he met the moment, as he always does.

With gentle grace, Father Rohr guides us through our toughest questions, like:

  • How do we live compassionately in a time of violence and despair? And what can we do with our private disappointments and the anger we feel in such an unjust world?
  • What can we do? Non-violent resistance is our chief responsibility right now. Like John Lewis said, these times call for some “good trouble”. Join the marches, call and write our elected leaders, and mobilize strategically for upcoming elections. We have several democratic tools at our disposal.
  • Where can we look for inspiration? Father Rohr talks to us about his latest project, The Tears of Things, which recounts the timeless wisdom of the Hebrew prophets and notes “If we can understand the prophets so poorly, if at all, no wonder we have not understood Jesus.” 
  • What’s one thing we can do to live prophetically in these chaotic times?
  • And Father Rohr tells us what is giving him hope today. You’ll find it contagious.

Cultivating Belonging and Evolving Faith with Jeff Chu

Jeff Chu, an award-winning journalist, author, and “sort-of-kind-of farmer,” joins Jen on the For the Love podcast to discuss his book, Good Soil: The Education of an Accidental Farmhand. In the book, Jeff shares stories from his time at “The Farminary”, a twenty-one-acre working farm at Princeton’s Theological Seminary, where students explore life’s biggest questions while cultivating the earth. 

Jeff reflects on his own struggles with faith, identity, and the expectations placed upon him as a gay man raised in a conservative Christian environment. His journey reveals the challenges of cultivating, not just plants, but also a spiritual life that is authentic, evolving, and inclusive?. 

In this conversation, Jeff, Jen and Amy discuss: 

  • What Jeff learned at the “Farminary” about creating “good soil,” drawing lessons from the rhythms of growth, decay, and regeneration that define life on the land
  • Finding moments of grace and healing, showing that even what seems barren can become fertile with care and time
  • Challenging traditional interpretations of the biblical Parable of the Sower, shifting the focus from categorizing people as “good” or “bad” soil to understanding how soil and the human soul are shaped by external forces and capable of transformation and growth
  • Exploring faith, not as something static, but as something that evolves – much like soil that is constantly changing and being enriched.

Melinda French Gates on The Next Day and the Beauty in What Comes Next

If we’re lucky, most of us will live an abundant life that’s filled with a number of significant transitions. How we embrace those inevitable life changes and honor that growth can make a big difference in how we are prepared to meet future challenges.

Today, Jen and Amy have the pleasure of sitting down with Melinda French Gates to discuss how, at 60, she is stepping into this next beautiful season of life. By giving a rare glimpse into her interior life, and sharing previously untold stories included in her new memoir, The Next Day: Transitions, Change and Moving Forward, Melinda shares the heart-connecting lessons that we all can apply to the universal moments in our lives – including becoming a parent, the loss of a close friend, the loss of a marriage, knowing the right time to make a career move.

In this episode, we discuss:

  • The art of letting go and beginning again and making the most of the time between an ending and a new beginning
  • How growing up in a middle-class Catholic family influenced Melinda’s values and worldview
  • What it looks like to loosen the bonds of perfectionism and embrace uncertainty in times of change
  • The new projects, ideas and hopes Melinda has for the future

Fixing the Broken Pieces with Ian Morgan Cron

Everyone is an addict. Mr. Rogers…The Dali Lama… Michelle Obama! Mull that idea over for a minute and when you’re done being outraged like we were, join us for this enthralling conversation with one of our favorite repeat guests on For the Love – author, psychotherapist, and Episcopal priest, Ian Morgan Cron. Today, we’re talking to him about his new book, The Fix: How the Twelve Steps Offer a Surprising Path of Transformation for the Well-Adjusted, the Down-and-Out, and Everyone In Between.

People pleasing, the need to be right, being a compulsive helper, workaholism, being a knowledge junkie, perfectionism, holding on to our past suffering – these are all forms of addiction. The simple truth is, we each resort to our own methods of dealing with the harder aspects of life. For some, that solution means turning to a substance to numb our pain, which is how we traditionally think of addiction. For others, there are behaviors we employ to manipulate what we are feeling. And that’s where the rest of us fall into the sticky trap.

Ian, who also hosts the wildly popular Typology podcast exploring the mystery of the human personality, teaches us how the Twelve Steps are a trusted tool for anyone seeking to move beyond self-help to a more profound sense of awakening.

And, in a new segment called “To My Younger Self”, Jen and Amy share some deeply personal experiences that, for Amy, helped change her relationships and, for Jen, helped change how she viewed herself.

Sacred Reimagination: When Faith Evolves with You: Erin Hicks Moon

In this second installment of our special Midlife Renaissance series, the delightful Erin Hicks Moon joins Jen and Amy for a super resonant conversation to discuss what it looks like when the faith that you grew up with bears no resemblance to your current values and what matters to you today. But Erin reassures us that if our faith looked like it did 10, 15, even 20 years ago, we would not be evolving.

Erin is the host and resident bible scholar of the Faith Adjacent podcast and author of I’ve Got Questions: The Spiritual Practice of Having It Out with God. She’s a thoughtful guide for processing our questions, curiosity, and doubt.   

Women naturally come into midlife with a posture of comfort in things they are sure of and curiosity to explore the things that they aren’t. There are many people searching for answers in the wilderness of faith but, as Erin reminds us, our questions can lead to a more vibrant and joyful faith.

Bethany Joy Lenz: Breaking Free, Finding Faith, and Dinner for Vampires

This week Jen and Amy sit down with actress, musician, and author Bethany Joy Lenz to discuss her deeply personal memoir, Dinner for Vampires: Life on a Cult TV Show (While also in an Actual Cult!). Bethany opens up about her experience in a high-control group, known as “The Big House Family” religious cult, the complexities of spiritual abuse, and how she found her way back to faith and autonomy with the help of a One Tree Hill fan. They explore themes of manipulation, resilience, and the power of telling your story.

This raw and inspiring conversation offers hope, clarity, and empowerment for anyone navigating their own path to freedom.

Jen and Amy “Rant or Rave” about New Year’s resolutions and Amy teaches us some creative perspectives to take to feel more successful in this space. 

And we reminisce about our favorite shows from the early 2000s. West Wing… the best! Criminal Minds, 24, Grey’s Anatomy, all binge-able. Gilmore Girls, c’mon. And what about One Tree Hill?

Hope and Liberation in Advent: Dr. Angela N. Parker on Womanist Theology

Settle in, listeners. Jen and Amy have invited Greek and New Testament professor and scholar, Reverend Dr. Angela N. Parker to the show to reflect on the Advent season with some words of hope and liberation. She took our butts to seminary, opening our eyes to what it looks like when you examine the scripture through the lens of womanist theology and the experiences of Black women. But as Dr. Parker tells us, “I’ve lived long enough to know that God will bring me through but sometimes it’s hard and sometimes it hurts. But even after the hurt, the tender spots get more resilient.”

There’s so much to unpack in this one.

  • Jen and Amy discuss their favorite Christmas movies and debate whether classics like Gremlins and Die Hard fit the genre 
  • Dr. Parker explains how liberation is a collective journey, not an individual one – and how everyone, including white men, can need it.
  • We learn how understanding the historical context of scripture is vital for its interpretation.
  • And we also talk about some of the holiday hullabaloo we’re ready to Bless and Release this season.

Krista Tippett: Making Spiritual Conversations Relatable and Real

Krista Tippett’s work in the realm of spirituality and human experience is unparalleled. She just has a divine gift for distilling complex topics into clear, palatable information that we can sit with, dissect, and examine. She uses her OnBeing podcast as a place to conduct honest conversations with theologians and thought leaders about what it means to be human, what it means to be alive. Curiosity is welcome in her space. She brings a sense of calm to everything around her. So during the frenzy of the holidays, which can be both joyful and stressful, we wanted to circle back to this centering conversation with Krista to decompress and be at peace with the world. This conversation feels like an oasis in what is always a chaotic month so it’s our gift to bring it back for you this week. 

Scott Erickson Paints an Honest Picture of an Advent Season of Hope

As we journey into this Advent season, Scott Erickson, better known to most by his moniker in the internet and art world as Scott the Painter, discusses his journey of faith and the creation of his ‘Honest Advent,’ project aimed at reinterpreting traditional Christmas narratives through a lens of vulnerability and authenticity. He reflects on the paradoxes of belief, the importance of community, and the need for honest conversations about faith and the human experience, particularly during the Advent season. With a great deal of compassion and humor, Scott shares insights into his creative process, the significance of connection in his work (which has resonated so deeply with his community that many have it tattooed on their bodies), and the need for honest spiritual experiences in today’s world. His work is not just visually beautiful. It’s also meaningful, bringing a beautiful new approach to an old and familiar story.

[ENCORE] All Will Be Well: Lessons for Hard Times from Our Friend Amy Grant

We’re going deep into the archives to pull out a special conversation for this week’s bonus episode with our most beloved friend, Grammy Award-winning singer/songwriter, Amy Grant. The last time Jen and Amy sat down together, it was on the heels of an exhausting, arduous time in our county. Back then, Amy delivered some profound words of wisdom in the peaceful, soothing way that only she can. And we felt her words would be a welcome balm to soothe our weary souls today so we’ve brought it back for you to enjoy as a bonus episode!

In addition to some very timely words of wisdom from Amy, this episode covers:

  • Navigating life’s difficulties while maintaining a positive outlook — Amy shares a touching story about the final lesson she’s learned from her parents
  • Amy discusses her journey of healing from unexpected open heart surgery and she and Jen talk about learning to respect their bodies and live more in balance
  • The importance of community and support systems, especially when enduring hard circumstances
  • The complexities of cancel culture which has come for Amy on more than one occasion in her career and personal life
  • The evolution of Contemporary Christian Music (CCM) and the “The Queen of Christian Pop’s” impact on music that transcends genres and generations